Why are we doing this?

[ragtag]

This may sound like a silly topic. But lately I've been thinking "Why am I doing online comix?". It's not like I'm making any money of it (hosting is actually costing me money) or that I have a huge fan base to bloat my ego. In fact lately there has been lots of stress at work, and I've just been adding to it by putting pressure on myself to get going with a comix project (so far they've all been story ideas and sketches, or overly ambitious projects that got stuck http://www.ragtag.net/xternal/red/ ). Previously I had a lot of stuff to get of my chest (coming out and stuff like that), and a lots of that wound up in my comics....but now when that weight is lifted, I don't feel that "need" to get stuff out any more. So why am I trying to write online comics? I honestly don't know. Maybe I should just go out and live some, and then come back and write some more.

So I guess I'm curious to know what keeps you guys going? Why are you doing this?

Cheers,

Ragnar

[gazorenzoku]

I had some feelings similar to yours, so I made a print comic too. It was fun, and satisfied some cravings that web comics didn't satisfy for me. Now that I am done with my print comic, I am going back to web comics for a while.

If you are unsatisfied with web comics, I recomend making a print comic. It can be a good learning experience and it will teach you about working at a higher dpi and such...

Anyhow, with the exception of people who turn out an instand web comic hit and get either money or at least a lot of fans, everyone has to have their own reasons to make a webcomic. My current reasons are this:

1) Working at a low dpi is more fun than working at a high one.
2) I want to use color.
3) I want to use an "infinite canvas" of space.
4) I want to make something that anyone in any place, at any time, can read.
5) I want to make something my friends, who all live in different places now, can all read.

The drawbacks, that I am willing to accept for now, are:

1) Not a lot of people caring about it.
2) No money.

As long as the positives outweigh the negatives, it can be fun. If those two negative points (which are almost a given for anyone starting out in webcomics) get to be overwhelming, make a physical print comic!

Also, as far as getting more people to visit sites, I think it is important to keep file sizes low. Yeah, it is fun to to all sorts of blending and stuff on Photoshop, but if you keep your file size low by using flat colors and saving as a gif file instead of a jpg or png, you will probably get more visitors. An exception to this is Makeshift Miracle, which does well with jpg files.....

The comment about file sizes isn't aimed at anyone's site in particular. It's just something I have been thinking about recently...

vince

[Guest]

I'm just putting together my first web comic right now, but I have been wondering about how it will play out over the long term and wrestling with these very issues. I turned to web comics because I was feeling very frustrated at not being able to do the kinds of stories I want to in my primary medium (film/TV) so for me personally right now I am just enjoying it for myself and not treating it as a business venture.

I think if you want to have any success you have to really love doing what you do. If your heart is really in it, the work can be it's own reward and any success is just gravy. Of course money is always an issue, but I've found recognition in any field only comes after alot of hard work and paitence (there is the odd "first-time hit" but these seem to be the exceptions to this rule).

As long as the positives outweigh the negatives, it can be fun. If those two negative points (which are almost a given for anyone starting out in webcomics) get to be overwhelming, make a physical print comic!

I agree, if you don't really want to do it, don't force yourself; try something new and go back to webcomics later when you feel re-energized!

[gazorenzoku]

the work can be it's own reward

I think that is an important part for any field, but even more so in any field where the line between hobby and professionalism is so sketchy, like web comics. If you do anything for any professional comic book company, anything at all, no matter how small, you can at least say, "here is what I did, and here is the income it earned me." If you are the person who does the color seperations, if you only draw the squares (I heard that there used to be a person who only did squares, but maybe that never was...), if you just take down the phone numbers of people who called the office... whatever you do, there is a process that leads to a comic that is read by people and a paycheck that is delivered to you or your bank account. Even if you wind up doing a crappy job, but not crappy enough to get fired, you are and will continue to be PART OF A PROCESS. But, if you make a web comic, no matter how good you are you often will not feel that you are part of any process.

You might feel alone.

You might feel like no one cares.

...and you might be right.

So if you are looking for attention, web comics might not be the best place to look. Call a friend. Make a print comic and show it to lots of people.

If you are looking for a personal satisfaction that comes after making something you like (i.e. a self satisfying product), and even more: if you are looking for a thing that you enjoy doing (i.e. a self satisfying process), then web comics are the best thing ever because you get to do everything you could to with a print comic and more:

color, unlimited space, interactivity and dynamic HTML, and who knows what else..

[rcar]

I've gone through ups and downs with my web comic too. But bottom line, I love doing it. Cartooning is just in my blood. What I didn't like was keeping a schedule. It became to much a second job and I wasn't going to do that for free. If I was getting paid it would be a different story. Of course my hits have gone way down because I update so irregularly, but I enjoy it much more.

[thrdgll]

Obviously, what's unique about the process of web comics is the self-imposed schedule. Even those self-publishing in print have to acknowledge the expectations of retail distribution schedules. But, outside of basic readership considerations (ie - will they stay interested in my comics if they don't appear consistantly), the web cartoonist is free to produce and post work at his or her own pace.

Still, this has the potential side effect of decreased motivation. If there's no real schedule in place to "crack the whip", it can be difficult to justify further cartooning in the face of other distractions or wandering interest.

Personally, I'm no fan of the break-neck pace of mainsteam comics. In fact, I find it sort of depressing when I consider how handicapped many otherwise-great cartoonists have been in keeping to that horrible schedule over the decades. A pragmatist will advise to force yourself to create even when the well seems dry for the sake of sheer productivity and timely delivery. But honestly, what sort of work does that usually produce?

As with so many other aspects of internet communication, there may be standard expectations of comic strip schedules, but no rules. Embracing this freedom means we do not have to match another artist's output. We can set our own schedules or no schedules at all. This appeals to the idealist in me, who seems more interseted in creating work of personal importance rather than pushing a pencil habitually.

After all, our biggest inspirations are most likely to strike when we put away our pens, turn off our computers and simply move with the flow of living.

Ashley

[KarstenTS]

I'm pretty new to webcomics, and it's more of a hobby for me. I like drawing, I always did and now I found a new cool way to publish it. My first way...

The best way to be motivated in my opinion is to read through this forum! After surfing around, reading a lot of posts and checking a lot of links I
had to jump into a comic jam. I read a lot more and working for my first WebComic. It's great to share the own work with so many so damned talented people all over the world!

This Forum ist motivation enough for me...
Thanks to all of you, that keep motivating me!

[Tim Mallos]

I do my comics and other media playing purely for my own entertainment. It's fun when someone comments on something I've posted, but I get most of my enjoyment simply from making something I like.

It's a great creative outlet for me. I'm doing what I want to do. At work, I do what the people paying the bill want me to do (more or less ).

It's simply a wonderful hobby for me. The fact that I can publish to the Web does give my work a destination which further "legitimizes" whatever time I spend.

The comics are a fun diversion I can work on in my head while driving, changing diapers, taking out the trash, etc.

Also, I believe that comics is the only visual story-telling medium in which quality work can be created by a single person.

[ragtag]

I guess my problem is that I'm taking myself and my comics too seriously, and in the process I'm forgetting to just have fun and enjoy making them. To treat comics and animaton I do in my free time as a hobby, like skiing or building remote controlled model aircrafts or whatever, and if people like it or I earn some cash from it, that's just a bonus.

So why am I doing this? I guess it's for the enjoyment of doing it, because it keeps me thinking and gives me a feeling of achievement when I do something I like.

Ragnar

p.s. Thanx for the inspiration.

[japanimationfist]

Bingo! It has to be fun, and it has to be about the pleasure of making comics. None of us is going to rich at this (not under the current circumstances, at any rate), and most of us probably wouldn't want to, because it would mean acknowledging that there are consumers putting down money that expect to be entertained.

I started my comic quite recently, for many of the same reasons cited above, but there was another factor that contributed, and that was excitement. When I finished reading Scott McCloud's Reinventing Comics a few years ago I desperately wanted to do comics, but I hadn't drawn anything in years, and the sorts of things I wrote didn't make for good comics. My brother James, and one of my good friends, Matt shepherd, both wanted to do comics, but had no outlet, so I encouraged them to look into webcomics. I think I secretly wanted to do it myself, but I didn't have the (insert expletive) to give it a shot.

Last year kicked the crap out of me. I got divorced, changed jobs, changed towns, and changed my circle of friends as a result of the other three things. At the same time, all of those things seemed to free up a lot of energy that was being mis-directed. I started drawing again, filling more sketchbooks and drawing pads in the last twelve months than I have in the last twelve years. The point is that sometimes stress is a catalyst for change, and ultimately for creation.

Your question about what comes next is a good one. What do you do when you don't have anything on your chest any more. Well, I suspect that you stop, or, if you're having fun, and you love what you're doing, you keep on. There's no right or wrong, except where it applies to what is right or wrong for you.

I don't know if I will keep my webcomic going indefinitely (in fact, I know I won't), but now that I have been doing it for a few months, and I have been having fun with it, I can almost guarantee that I will keep drawing, and that's something I never knew I would get out of this.

There are so many things that we do so naturally as children that we tend to stop or leave behind when we become adults. I tend to look at making a webcomic as a way of reclaiming some of that childhood territory, and expanding my horizons a little. Nothing I am doing is brilliant, but at the moment, I can see the progress I make every time i put up a new strip, and every time I do something kind of cool, I want to do another one, a better one, and so it continues.

If I can speak as a writer for a moment, however, I would have to say that the biggest reason to keep going, besides fun, is character. If you love who you're writing/drawing, then you won't want to let them die. I don't know if you're familiar with Terry Moore's "Strangers in Paradise", but there is a series that has nearly come to an end several times, but in the end Terry has always kept it going, because he loves his characters. I'm sure that it was the same for Charles Schultz.

I had a look at your link, ad it's obvious to me that you have talent. I hope you'll keep it up, but do whatever's right for you.

[Murak]

I've been doing a Webcomic since May 2002. My subject matter is pretty, well, boring to most people. My ART is Okay, and getting better. My writing is weak, but it's also SLOWLY improving. Not many people read it, and those that do rarely return.

So WHY do I bother making sure I do an Update every week?

Well, my subject is pretty dull to most people, but I like it, and maybe there ARE one or two people like me out there (if I can ever reach them).

My Art and Writing are getting better ... that's a practical reward if nothing else!

But most importantly, I just NEED to do it. Even if nobody is looking, the satisfaction to have SOME sort of closure on my work is
reason enough.

Besides, my comic could not exist in any other form (you want me publish WHAT?).

And who would go the route of Paper when you can paint with Light?

[gazorenzoku]

Japanamation Fist brings up a good point. There's no harm in stopping if you want to stop...

vince

[Tim Mallos]

Murak!
I think your work is really cool! I haven't visited your site before, but I will be back!

Tim

[gazorenzoku]

Yes, both Ragnar and Murak have great sites! When I made that comment about it being ok to quit, it had nothing at all to do with the quality of the comics on anyone's site. I just meant that if you don't enjoy doing it at any time, for whatever reason, there is no law that says you have to continue....

But of course you should keep going cause you are all making interesting stuff....

vince

[catgarza]

i sometimes wonder why i'm doing this at all too. it's been a few years now and i'm just tired, you know? one of the people i've admired for a LONG time, dave cooper, is gonna be laying off comics for a while, apparently. wants to do painting and kid's shows and such. i feel that draw, too, everyday. i'd almost rather show up in juxtapoz than the journal. take 2 months, like mark ryden, then have this bad ass piece of art that i could turn into a print or the cover of an album or whatever.

but i love comics. always have. they were the first love, not painting or sculpture or developing kids cartoons. if i can produce a decent comic, the opportunity to do the other stuff may present itself, you know?

believe me, though, i know where you're coming from.

[gazorenzoku]

Just for the record, right now I spend most of my time painting. I really want to be able to spend more time doing comics, but I can't right now. I enjoy the painting I'm making, but everyday I think, "wow, wouldn't life be great if all I did was comics..."

I guess the grass is always greener on the other side...

Or maybe some artists need to do different kinds of art to feel satified...

vince

[Tim Mallos]

The grass is always redder and growing in the sky if you are a surrealist.

[lcachola]

Because it beats sitting around all day wondering what I could be doing with my life instead of, well, sitting around all day waiting for stuff to happen. Also, I feel better I've created something I can share with people instead of simply being a sponge for advertisers and pop culturer. Plus, there's the added benefit of developing and improving my drawing and storytelling skills. And, finally, there's nothing like working all day for money, then coming home and, well, working all night for free.

[thrdgll]

Yes, yes, yes! You've hit on it exactly! Everyone should be encouraged to PRODUCE creatively, even if it's just quilting or building model ships, rather than simply sit and consume the work of others. Particularly if that work is the typical mainstream sludge.

Ashley

[lcachola]

Yes, yes, yes! You've hit on it exactly! Everyone should be encouraged to PRODUCE creatively, even if it's just quilting or building model ships, rather than simply sit and consume the work of others.

Great! Glad to see we're in agreement! Now buy my book.

[thrdgll]

Great! Glad to see we're in agreement! Now buy my book.

Quiet you!
Ash

[gazorenzoku]

When I first started making comics, I wanted to use comics to express myself creatively. I had some ideas I wanted to get off my chest, and some art styles that I wanted to try out.

I still feel those things, but recently I am starting to incorperate something new into my comics making. I want to do 2 things:

1) Make the kind of comics I would want to read (almost like the comics critic inside of me getting a chance to say, "here is how it should be done")

2) Give people that same thrill that I get when I know I am about to receive a new Alred, Morrison, Woodring, Milligan, etc. in the mail (I have to order my comics, but it is the same thing as, say, picking up some comics at a store and waiting till you get home to read them). I love that anticipation that one of those beautiful works of wonder is about to unfold in front of me. I want to be a producer of that same kind of feeling for others.

Offhand, I was trying to pin that feeling down today, and all I could think of is, "it's like ice cream". That feeling that I get when I realize that I have enough money in my bank account to order yet another big shipment of stuff by those guys that I really love.... that feeling is just like ice cream. It's creamy, sweet, and a little bit naughty....

Hey, we're all adults here, right? It's ok for me to talk about this stuff, right?....

Anyhow, those 2 new motivations are meshing with my first motivation just fine. I suppose if I only had the first motivation, the motivation that comes from a need to express something, then I would eventually get tired of comics because it takes soooo long to express relatively so little..... Also, when you don't feel the need to express any longer, poof, there goes your comic book.

And I think that was the problem that motivated Ragnar to start this thread:

Previously I had a lot of stuff to get of my chest (coming out and stuff like that), and a lots of that wound up in my comics....but now when that weight is lifted, I don't feel that "need" to get stuff out any more. So why am I trying to write online comics?

So to Ragnar I say this: either find more stuff that makes you stressed out and write about it, or start trying to find other reasons to love reading and making comics.

vince

[losttoy]

I'll second that.

[ragtag]

It's true gazorenzoku...ice cream is a very good comparison. I love ice cream. People look at me in a weird way when I go out and buy ice cream in the middle of winter, wading through knee deep snow in -16 degrees Celsisus and eat it outdoors (don't know what that is in farenheit...but at least my ice cream doesn't melt in it). Cold is only relative to the amount of clothes you wear.

find more stuff that makes you stressed out and write about it

Hehe...I might just do that. I'll probably be loosing my job in a few months as the film we're working on nears completion, and that might involve relocating to somewhere new to find a job (I've been considering NewZealand, Canada, BeNeLux, France, Sweden, maybe Japan and more.....suggestions welcome ). That might involve some stress, but hopefully mostly new and interesting experiences.

Since I started this thread, I've been playing around with game programming. I've had this little game idea in my head that I've wanted to make for ages, so why not give it a shot. I'm learning lots of new stuff including how to do a side scrolling game...which might turn out to be great for future infinite canvas comics.
I guess doing something technical (like programming) for a while, is going to leave me lusting for something "primitive" like paper, ink, brushes, pens and pencils.

Ragnar


p.s. I don't see loosing my job as a bad thing (it's to be expected in the animation industry), it's just the start of something new.